TB scared of floating!

Discussion in 'Problem Horses' started by TahliaMatches, Dec 13, 2011.

  1. Que Sera Sera

    Que Sera Sera Well-known Member

    If you are going to quote me, then please quote what I said FULLY.

    I said that Fred gave him a tap, which is perfectly normal, when asking your horse to walk forward, he turned pig, ignored it and proceeded to continue to walk out over the top of Fred, so he got a harder wallop to walk forward. It was pure disrespect premised on the fact that I would give up if he kept walking over the top of me, which is who he thought was behind him.

    I also got an equal verbal kick up my backside for allowing him to get away with that behaviour and nagging him instead of telling him.

    Fred is a fantastic leader and my horse was totally relaxed at his place when I popped in for unexpected visit.

    I sent my horse to him and asked him to assess whether my horse was scared of floating. He affirmed my suspicion that there was no fear, he was just being rude, as I had allowed him to get away with it. Previous owner had no problems floating him as she again is a fantastic experienced leader.

    Please do not twist my words to insinuate that Fred is a bully. I never said nor implied that. What Fred is, is an experienced horse person who has helped hundreds of horses overcome behaviourable problems whether rooted in fear or dirt. He is able to assess and implement training methods dependant on what the root of the issue is. He starts horses, retrains those that have been screwed up due to REAL abuse or neglect from humans.
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2011
  2. Motown

    Motown New Member

    Hi I just wrote a long story on how my boy reared backwards on a float when I first got him but my phone died :-/ lol oh well point of the story was he was a freak when I first got him now he stands on the float for ages, self loads an is used as company for floating beginner an problem horses (all achieved with out bum ropes, food etc) an it's because I finally own my own floats an am lucky enough to be able to float train all the time, so if u are located near baldivis u r more then welcome To borrow one of my floats over the weekends or wat Eva (for free - just pay for if/any damages an wash it out after use) an I could show u how I got my boy doin well if u would like or need a hand, if ur interested u can contact me by email hsvchick@live.com.au, good luck :)
  3. Tallarook

    Tallarook Well-known Member

    My goodness all these floating issues, i would suggest to get someone who specialises in this field, get your horse and yourself some decent training.

    All mine float from word go, i teach them all to tie up solid, i can load 2 of mine up on the side of the road on my own, then unload both. Teaching a horse young to lead up, tie up and having a handler who is firm, confident and who doesnt project nervous energies is very important.

    We have all started somewhere, i have had my time at not having a clue at what i was doing, I have had my turn at horses outsmarting and outdoing me. Some decent help from a very good old horseman helped me out heaps. Time and Money well spent........:)*
  4. beagle

    beagle Well-known Member

    Scorpio , could like, like, like your post 500 times over!
    I too once had a mare whom I knew could float well, but she pulled the wool over my eyes. So I went to a really really good horseman, & asked his advice & help, & have never looked back.
    Someone like SB or Mr HP are also persons with excellent advice.
    Never never never put up with a horse that has floating issues - fix it before you really need them to load quietly & without fuss! eg bushfires!!!

    All horses now that come into my, or indeed my friends whom i ride with, are all quickly educated about floating without problems. We must all load & transport our horses without assistance out here, otherwise we'd never go anywhere & have multitudes of dead horses!
  5. TahliaMatches

    TahliaMatches New Member

    Good news about Matches and float training! Someone who lives down the road from me has offered to float train her as she has the dual halter, which many people/friends have recommended to me.
  6. cupcake

    cupcake Well-known Member

    Dual halter? U don't need this, gadgets are a band aids and not always work forever. If the horse is rearing and banging its head on the roof ur pulling on its head when it pulls back.

    Unless this friend is an experienced horse person and has had difficult loaders please seek the advice of someone that does this for a living.

    If they screw the horse more, it's just going to take more money and time to undo.

    YOU need to learn to load this horse and work out what ur doing wrong.
  7. TahliaMatches

    TahliaMatches New Member

    this lady is an experienced person. she has worked with many troubleloaders and gets good results. she works with you AND the horse. i know that the dual halter willl not work forever but she said she had a horse like mine and once it learnt that if it balked the dual halter was there, so loaded really well after that as it didnt like the dual halter. the horse now loads without it everytime. i want to do ponyclub so need her to load everynow and then and this is my best option for a 'cure'
  8. OnaBenda

    OnaBenda New Member

    Agree with everyone re projecting confidence. My horse tried it on ONCE ! Took 3 hours and I thought, never again.
    A friend did a loading session with him not long after, up and down about 8 million times, no problem at all.
    Maybe twice since then he's stopped on the ramp with me - he immediately got rapped on the shoulder with the lead rope, spoken to very strongly, and backed up at warp speed.
    Can't remember the last time I had a problem with him now. I can't afford to have floating issues as I generally do everything myself.
    He used to scramble a bit too - so I'm sure he had a scary situation at some point, but he's pretty much a perfect floater now :)
    Good luck with it
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2012
  9. izzy2512

    izzy2512 Gold Member

    I think the main thing with floating issues is keeping up floating them AFTER you get them trained too. Too many people think 'oh I've paid $xyz so they're cured now', and go to try and float them a couple of months after and get in trouble. You really have to keep up with it, even if it means hiring a float every weekend or fortnight.
  10. Arnie

    Arnie Gold Member

    I think the method Fred was using that if the horse is going to back out of the float when not asked, he makes it uncomfortable for the horse, the moment the horse CHOOSES to stop or walk forward the pressure is taken off and THIS is the horses reward.

    Its exactly the method I used to use on a mare of mine. Oneday she went up and flew out.
    So I grabbed a whip and asked again, she flew out and I would wiggle the rope (mocking a shank if that makes sense) and with taps on the chest I sent her backwards and make it uncomfortable, I then stopped and asked her to walk forwards instantly and she did, pressure off and a "good girl" (no pats as we're still walking to the float).
    She tried one more time as a test and after that, never did it again.

    No bullying, just a form of horse talk. Floating you need to nip on the butt straight away and if it requires a firmer wack then so be it! Fred has used a 1-10 method, start of at 1, if the horse hasn't responded then move to level 2 and so on. Soon the horse learns if it doesn't respond to level ones feather gentle touch then each level gets harder. Bullying is WHIPPING painfully with no real tactic or using bum ropes!
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2012
  11. TahliaMatches

    TahliaMatches New Member

    Last edited: Apr 5, 2012
  12. Arnie

    Arnie Gold Member

    Totally agree! As long as your firm but not abusive with your 'pressure' and very quick to stop the second the horse does the right thing then its certainly not bullying :).

    I'm very lucky, my two self load. Even my filly who I didn't even float train! :eek:, just threw the lead rope over her neck and she walked on up like she done it a million times!
  13. CDA

    CDA Well-known Member

    You will struggle without a float to practise.

    I have found in the past that people can take their horses to someone for a week or two of float training but often if there is a long break till the next time you have to do it alone - your own nervousness or anxiety gives the horse a weird feeling, and then its back to old habits.

    With all my new horses, I create a routine....

    the go from stable, to float, to paddock... from paddock, to float, to stable!

    Might be three or four times a day when I first get them, so that walking into the float is just something they do on the way to the paddock or the stable.

    Its treating the float as no different than walking anywhere you want to go.
  14. TahliaMatches

    TahliaMatches New Member

    this is what some people dont understand. they think its bullying, its not. its meerly teaching them manners and right from wrong.
  15. NumidianHorse

    NumidianHorse Active Member

    If anyone wants a solid foundation of float loading - I can recommend someone (my coach).

    I have a mare who was everyone's worst nightmare!

    but who now (I MUST video this) consistently self loads - first time, every time (even last week during a colic episode) ... I'd worked with a LOT of extremely experienced people - all known on here ... with dually halters / every other trick in the book ... none of those gave the results that I got with my current coach (riding / groundwork) ...

    I highly recommend that both horse and owner get training without ANY tricks, bribes or special kit ... cos if you don't have that bit of kit with you on "the day" ... you're stuffed. .... get the foundation right (which isn't quick or easy) ... and you have a happy horse + human.
  16. cupcake

    cupcake Well-known Member

    Well best of luck.

    If no results I recommend Geoff sandel, I've gone from not being able to get tri on the float after 3 hours and giving up... To loading him in 1 min.

    It's taken 6 months, of constant training, sessions with Geoff, I think I've spent over $1000 with him. And patience, alot of it!

    Mind u trianda was one of the worse he's had.

    He last month, massive improvements, so proud of him and myslef.

    Give us another few months and he might be self loading.

    Geoff got to know I'm not one to give up hahaha
  17. blitzen

    blitzen Gold Member

    i agree, without a float to practice with, it's going to be tough. can you bribe a friend to leave their float at yours for a month?
  18. Nattyh

    Nattyh Guest

    Hi Tahlia,
    Your post says that your horses rears and hits its head in the float all before you have a chance to tie it up. So the horse does go on? But there are problems once on board?
    This suggests to me a couple of things-one- that she does not tie up without pulling back, and/or two- that she has been tied up before, on the float, BEFORE the bumbar has been done up. This will absolutely cause a horse to pull back and when they hit the end of the rope, that head will come up and in 99% of floats, the roof is too low and they WILL smash their head and from there on you have a big problem on your hands.
    So, does she tie up properly - not ON the float but just at the tie uprail or outside the float? You will need a proper breaking collar for this if she doesn't because when they have panic and pull back, it hurts them, and then all the silly ideas they had about needing to panic while tied up have been self-fulfilled - they make it come true. So your horse needs to be able to pull back safely without getting hurt if this is what he does.
    Most importantly though Tahlia, never, ever, ever tie (or try to tie) your horse up on the float unless the bum bar had been done up properly first. And the most important of all, when you do tie it, tie it so the rope is long enough for the horse to back into and feel the bum bar without being restricted by the rope or that head will come up and it will smash into the top of the float and it will be on for young and old!
    Then you will have a horse that says - no way in hell am I going in there 'cause when i do it all goes to hell- and she would be right.
    Loading and uploading from the float is simply yielding to pressure- can you lead your horse ANYWHERE you want to go, and it will go forward no matter what? Will it back up and halt and take one or two and halt- as many as you fancy to ask.
    You can improve yor horse's obedience at this stage without your own float by setting up obstacles/tarps/puddles etc- just use your imagination.
    I hope this help Tahlia.

    ETA: Tahlia, never, ever, ever tie a horse up with a Dually halter :-0 Anywhere, ever :)
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 20, 2012
  19. TahliaMatches

    TahliaMatches New Member

    yes. she does tie up and i realised what i did wrong. but now she's kinda weird around them.
  20. Deb2

    Deb2 Guest

    Nattyh, I like your posts very much!**)

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