De-sensitising horses

Discussion in 'Training Horses' started by taylor, Apr 25, 2011.

  1. lollipop

    lollipop Active Member

    Me to.**) I have a couple of red zone breeds and his books, DVD's and even TV shows have been very educational and inspirational in helping me train these dogs correctly. He is a champ.:D
     
  2. EVP

    EVP Gold Member

    The house yard wasn't dog-proof fencing is my guess. And because they never did anything naughty or evil at home I'd say they gave the family a very false sense of security.....one can assume that an animal is de-sensitised (in this case dog to stock and chickens) but it only takes one time for a dog to realise "wow I didn't know this was so much fun or that they tasted so good".....and they go from interested to obsessed very quickly.

    This is why behaviour that contributes to a possibly bad mind should not be encouraged (or condoned or defended) and add to that supervision and confinement and all should be well....*should- being the optimum word...lolol*
     
  3. wattle6180

    wattle6180 Gold Member

    I guess this brings us back to desensitizing horses as well **) For all the bomb-proofing we do...when they're in pain, or scared, they can quickly turn up in the Problem Horses threads.
     
  4. GeeJay

    GeeJay Guest

    What is bomb proofing does it mean removing something that is natural and instinctive, over the years humans have lost their ability to respond to danger.

    We can only hope that we get respect from our 4 legged companions what ever we throw at them, you can never dull nature or instinct you have to respect it and learn from it.
     
  5. EVP

    EVP Gold Member

    Yep.............and not ask for trouble!!.......ahahaha
     
  6. SMR

    SMR Well-known Member

    I wasn't going to get involved in the "dog" debate, but I've just watched the video and am quite horrified :( When my horses get excited or panic, I cringe and stop the crazy running around asap for fear of injury. It doesn't take much for an excited/panicked horse to fall, do a tendon whilst sliding to a stop or try to jump a fence.

    I suppose I don't know the capabilities of other horses (perhaps they're not as silly as mine when they run??)
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2011
  7. wattle6180

    wattle6180 Gold Member

    For me, "bomb proofing" is getting a horse marketable. By that, I mean the average Joe Bloggs can do the basic things that they've seen in the movies *#)*#) Making the horse comfortable in a world that we, the humans, have created for it.
     
  8. EVP

    EVP Gold Member

    SMR, I'd say your horses are as silly as every other horse on the planet....ahaha. And while you cringe and look horrified you can also bet that most experienced horse owners would do the same....
    So I hate to break it to ya - but you're horses are not silly and neither are you....lolol ;)
     
  9. KC Quarter Horses

    KC Quarter Horses Gold Member

    YOu know Lollipop I am getting a little sick of your attitude.

    Firstly I have never had an injury with my horses relating to Dogs.

    Secondly, I wasnt even there when that video was taken, I was overseas working.

    Thirdly, I dont allow dogs to chase horses and if you bother to look at the video the dog ran in to bark at the horse and was called back by Donna and he left.

    It is not a fact that all dogs will attack horses at all. Some dogs like to chase, some dogs like to attack and some dogs do neither, It might be a fact in your mind but not in mine. Dogs are smart creatures and when you have a good bond with them they protect what is theirs....that means their owners and those things that belong to the owner ...ie children, belongings,other pets.

    If you dont have a relationship like that with your dog then you are truely missing out on one of lifes great pleasures.

    As for playing with horses and IYO something that should not be done.

    Go read the thread on the Double Dan team...... those boiys play with their horse all the time and teach them many tricks. They bring joy to many other people, themselves and their horses.......but I suppose you think that is wrong too
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 4, 2011
  10. EVP

    EVP Gold Member

    Can we keep it general please. The video depicted an individual horse - so posters commented on what they saw.
    For me personally it wouldn't have mattered where the clip came from or who owned the horses - it was about discussing what was displayed.

    No one mentioned anything about the person or owners........except to answer the comments that sort to justify the clip and the actions of the dog.

    If anyone else has seen clips of dogs playing/chasing horses they are welcome to post them for comment - and they will expect to get the same general unbiased responses. All this idiotic indignation is tiresome and boring.
    Not to mention the repeated personal referrences and attacks.
    You post it - it gets commented on. You don't want comments - don't post.

    I couldn't hear anyone calling a dog back.......I thought there was music playing? Could be wrong here.
    The dog in the video actually came in a number of times to interact with the horse?
    There was a second dog (Kelpie X or Cattle dog) that also looked to be inside the horse yard and running after the horse.
    You also mentioned that it is a regular thing for your happy boxer to "play" with the horses and get groomed by them? Boxers are very happy and exuberant dogs...no one is saying anything about the DOG.....I'd actually like to own a boxer.

    Not a single post suggests that this dog attacked horses. Not a single post about dogs protecting children or belongings or pets. No one said that dogs attacked horses - it was suggested that given the right circumstances ANY dog had the potential to turn dangerous. Not a single post suggested YOUR dog did anything other than what your video shows.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2011
  11. Anna E

    Anna E Guest

    In the words of my father, a Nationally (UK) renowned dog trainer of some 45 years and more - ahem - "bullshit". ALL dogs have the capacity in there (and to refer to an earlier post I've met some pretty feral Pomeranians *#))
    Dogs certainly can and do come to adopt kids, other dogs etc as part of their "family" but a horse - a large 4 legged prey animal - I doubt it! That's a big reach for any dog - this prey animal, in opposition to your thousands of years of instinct and behaviour, is NOT prey - it is to be respected. And the dog is to be expected t o work that out on it's own??';'

    We brought a new dog home yesterday. He APPEARS to have NO chase instinct whatsoever - but IMO he does have one - it's just less easily brought to the surface than others (one of the reasons we got him and not a Blue Heeler LOL). He may not have an easily roused desire to chase.. does that mean he will be allowed to run into the horses' paddocks and "play? Hell NO. He will be introduced in controlled circumstances and have it firmly pointed out to him that they are NOT a toy. Same way that our 6 inch tall crossbred dog was - she could not possibly do any harm herself but if the horse has an eye on her not where he's going and there is a fence or a child in his path...
    We owe it to the pets in our lives to "draw the line" well within the sphere of absolute safety - then when they stuff up and overstep that line, the dog or the horse does not pay with injury and even euthanasia...
     
  12. EVP

    EVP Gold Member

    Fantastic reply.........over our 30 years on properties we've had a number of breeds from small to large from working to gun dogs to tiny lap dogs. The worst of them were shot or rehomed for chasing stock or repeatedly escaping. One was a pure-bred Kelpie, one was a pure-bred Staffy, one was a pure-bred Cattle dog and one was a chocolate Lab. Despite our best efforts with training and containment they proved over and over that they couldn't be trusted. We respect our neighbours and the code of rural areas where dogs are not forgiven for chasing milk off cows, running fat and muscle off beefers, or causing mischief to other animals....the staffy I mentioned would dig a hole to China so he could walk 1klm to sit all day and eye-ball a guinea-pig cage!!! His obsession was "When they get out I am ready".....lolol

    The dogs we have now - 3 large and one tiny are permitted to walk with us at feed time but they stay outside the fences and yards....would I trust that they "knew" this rule and obeyed it if we were not there - Not on your life!!
     
  13. Go the Distance

    Go the Distance Well-known Member

    I love the part about the staffy eye balling the guinea pig cage EVP*#). I could just imagine it. At least you knew where to find him.

    I have to agree with both AnnaE and yourself about dogs being left to thier own devices, they sometimes make poor choices resulting in injuries to themselves or stock.
     
  14. Yarrabah Quarter Horses

    Yarrabah Quarter Horses Well-known Member

    Desensitised or do we class that as good handling? In my opinion a horse can be exposed to as much as you want and handle it, but something small that you never thought the horse would react to comes up. Do you now spend weeks on end making/forcing your horse to accept that scarey object?

    De-sensitising horses in my opinion comes down to overall handling and respect from both human and beast.

    Regards = Sue
     
  15. Anna E

    Anna E Guest

    I forgot to point out that the new dog is a roo dog... so in theory should have a VERY high chase drive.. but he, as an individual, does not. Same as SOME Labs or Pomeranians (breeds with a generally low chase and kill drive) will have a higher drive than "typical" members of the breed. So we can't really rely totally on breed as an indication either.
     
  16. sil

    sil Gold Member

    My Pomeranian has a very high prey drive, we use him to kill mice.
     
  17. KC Quarter Horses

    KC Quarter Horses Gold Member

    **Keep personal stuff OFF the forum**
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 5, 2011
  18. GeeJay

    GeeJay Guest

    **Keep personal stuff OFF the forum**
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 5, 2011
  19. Mod 1

    Mod 1 Moderator

    Back on track please and leave personal issues OFF the forum
     
  20. Go the Distance

    Go the Distance Well-known Member

    Yarrabah what you say is so true with 'desensitising'. I have had trouble putting baking paper, padding and bandages on my mare. I put the baking paper over Tuff Rock on her legs BTW not to cover up her 'shanks' to her ready for the oven. Mind you sometimes I feel like putting her in the oven:D.

    We went to the horse breaker yesterday and he did heaps of work with trying to get her over her fears using the good old chaff bag etc etc. So she was fine yesterday with him after she got herself sorted. I repeated all of the same things today in the round yard and she was fine.

    I thought great if she can tolerate a whole chaff bag flapping around her she won't mind 30cm X 20cm of baking paper. Oh no no no TOTAL HYSTERIA. Charged around the whole round yard like a maniac, took me about 35 minutes for her to let me even get near her with the baking paper. Eventually after we both had a rest and she let herself think straight she let me touch her legs with it.

    My lesson with this is that you can desensitise a horse as much as you like to trick yourself into thinking they are 'bomb proof' but they are never going to be. They will always be a horse with a flight, fright and fight brain.

    So all you endurance riders if you don't want me to pass you just wave a piece of baking paper at us, guanteed to land my butt in the dirt:D.
     

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