Coloured Thoroughbreds - How?????

Discussion in 'Colour Questions' started by simbin, Aug 21, 2008.

  1. Tintara

    Tintara Well-known Member

    "Hi Wesausgirl, Kintara and Tintara. Great that you aired your points of view."

    I only commented on the Bend D'or spots in response to Wesausgirl's query as to what they were and haven't expressed an opinion one way or the other about anything else that has been discussed in this thread. **)

    Winningcolours - lovely colt; my aim is to breed a solid paly or cremello version though. ;)
     
  2. winningcolours

    winningcolours New Member

    Hi Chrome. As you call an overo “OLWS pos”, I expect you refer to other colours by their genes also and call a bay “Agouti pos” and a chestnut a“Homozygous red pigment”. I am just curious as to why you are so hell bent on rubbishing the overo horse. Overo horses have been around for hundreds (if not thousands) of years. Yet you want to play God and eradicate them. I went to a horse sale last fortnight and witnessed what I have seen time and time again - which is almost the norm at these type of horse sales- neglected, starving and ill treated horses. Many of them only young and many purchased by the doggers. It led me to wonder… if they had the beautiful frame overo coat pattern and were worth a substantial amount of money would they have ended up in this situation? I think you need to review who and what is ethical. If the Paint horse association thought frames were defective they wouldn't have a registry for them. Like in all of society you are always going to get someone doing the wrong thing, but this is no reason to crucify the rest. Perhaps your energies would be better used saving the whale.
     
  3. chrome

    chrome New Member

    No.I call it OLWS pos so that people are aware that it is carrying one copy of a gene that is lethal in its homozygous form. Overo in many countries refers to sabino,splash etc..as in any non tobiano patern, calling it OLWS pos makes it easier and correct to confirm that the horse is a genuine lethal carrying frame overo. You will find as you become more experienced in breeding in this area that it is common practice all over the world to advertise and indicate CLEARLY and honestly the horses OLWS pos status. Its something called responsibility.
     
  4. winningcolours

    winningcolours New Member

    The word FRAME confirms a horses OLWS pos status. Visiting internet sites in the UK and USA which are specific on OLWS they refer the horse as a frame-overo each and every time. Here is a link :- http://www.avitronics.co.uk/lwo.html . But if it makes you feel better that you have done your duties referring to the frame overo as OLWS positive go ahead. I am aware this referral is standard with many who rubbish the frame overo and use it as a scare tactic. Before our current understanding of the frame gene I can completely understand a taboo and stigma surrounding it. There is no hiding nor denying the fact that every frame overo will test positive for one copy of the LWO GENE. But it is so basic – do not breed frame to frame. Sorry but I don’t see the problem - unless of course you are a colour breeder using other genes and you want to create one. Thanks for the discussion, it has been a pleasure!
     
  5. chrome

    chrome New Member

    You can rubbish experienced breeders as much as you want.It wont achieve anything. Yet again you are ignoring the plain and simple facts. Untill you place a link on your site explaining the entire O/N facts, then you are encouraging people to breed irresponsibly. yes, I do breed colour,coloured minitures, and I spend a lot of time and money testing and ensuring that my horses are not messed up by being solid olws pos/frames due to uneducated /uneducatING breeders.
     
  6. belambi

    belambi Active Member

    Chrome,(I have just realised who you are). I think it is very interesting and worthwhile that you are testing,especially since you have minatures, mainly because its a breed that bred for colour without a clue of what it was getting into. Obviously I can't mention names here but last year we tested a lovely leopard mini that was olws pos...stemming from his grandsire.He is now a stunning gelding! I think it is worth remembering that currently there are no olws pos tbs in Australia (other than this new one that WC has imported), so it is currently a much different and safer situation for them. I agree with your point about educating, but where does the buck stop being passed?.Breeders (mare owners) do need to take responsibility for their choices of a stallion..but on the other hand this is helped by being able to make an educated choice in the first place. I am fully aware of the current situation with coloured mini breeders since many of them organise their testing through me.

    WC Do you have any 'rule ' about breeding to olws pos mares of clients?..I see that many of the US studs have this not allowed on their contract?
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2008
  7. winningcolours

    winningcolours New Member

    Hi Belambi. We will never allow frame mares (pos olws gene) to be covered by Profile. Nor we will be standing him to Tobiano mares so there can be no masking of the overo gene, nor spread without knowledge. I am aware that a solid etc can also mask the frame-overo gene, however as frame-overo is a DESIRED quality and what breeders will be breeding for, it would be extremely unlikely that a solid frame would go unnoticed as all will be tested and would be a desired attribute for the progeny. We will be educating mare owners and like chrome we will be spending a lot of time and money testing and ensuring - that is pulling a few mane hairs and sending it away with $25!
     
  8. belambi

    belambi Active Member

    Thats a good policy!

    I am quite thrown by the 'expensive 'testing comment!.. as you point out ,testing is $25..which is nothing compared to the cost of breeding a mare,waiting a year for a foal, and having a lethal just because you couldnt be bothered testing!.. (referring to minis .. obviously not Tbs in Aus).
     
  9. belambi

    belambi Active Member

    Not meaning to hijack the thread..But have you seen this awesome example of a cropout..(ignore the conformation).. a standardbred..no history of white in its bloodlines..and then hey presto, mix genes and bake in a moderate oven! Ps ..DNA tested have confirmed that both sire and dam are who they are meant to be

    NYHETER: Macahan är en skäck | Travronden
     
  10. Kintara

    Kintara Well-known Member

    Oh yes I saw that, amazing isn't it!!! They haven't colour tested for anything have they? Mind you it might be negative for everything and just be a sabino/splash mix but would still be interesting to know.
    Cheers

    Danni
     
  11. belambi

    belambi Active Member

  12. blitzen

    blitzen Gold Member

    very pretty! gee whiz!
     
  13. mylittlepony

    mylittlepony Well-known Member

    hi guys......i dont have anything to say on this subject other than this is my sabino TB filly.......who i am planning on sending to Winning Colours to go to Profile in Stlye in a few years when i save up the money:D
    HI WINNING COLOURS@)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  14. Shiobhan

    Shiobhan Well-known Member

    ah theres my new horsey -snigger and runs away laughing-
     
  15. mylittlepony

    mylittlepony Well-known Member

    lol shio, stop stalking clowny:p:p
     
  16. Shiobhan

    Shiobhan Well-known Member

    I can and I will... you stalk grasa lol

    mmm other half has no issues with me buying tb's lol so wonder if he'll let me import a coloured race horsey lol jokes i know he wont but still I like them patchy ones :)
     
  17. Dollar

    Dollar Well-known Member

    This thread is a very interesting read. Beautiful boy you have there WC, all the best with him.
     
  18. Wrangler Miss

    Wrangler Miss Well-known Member

    I saw a Pally crop out TB for US$30k as a foal - It was gorgeous :)
     

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